We offer a full refund to all customers who have purchased before september-21-2011
We make this offer because you have purchased Primstar-2 on the basis of an Open sourced license. This license has now been changed to a Fair End User License Agreement and will affect all future upgrades beginning with Relase Primstar-2-dev-175.
If you want to keep our customer, you need to do nothing at all. You will continue to recieve updates as planned.
If you think that our license change contradicts your own expectations and future plans, we give you the opportunity to request a full refund of your purchase until october-23-2011 . To request your refund, please send a notecard to Gaia Clary with the title:
<your avatar name>: Refund request Primstar-2
You do not need to explain in detail why you want to be refunded.
Sorry for the inconveniences to this change of our license terms. But we felt like we have to protect ourself and our customers from experiencing any loss of value.
Gaia&Domino
Primstar-2 is a wonderful product. It may or may not be worth L$6000 but I was happy to support it as an very useful open source product and gladly paid to demonstrate that with the hopes that it would continue to be free.
While you are free to change your license and take back the freedoms you once shared, I am disappointed that you have done so. It was a pleasure to not only learn to build better sculpties but also to learn to program Python and script in Blender. Your license change no longer allows me to follow your work or use what I learn from you.
Your only comment on the change is that it is “to protect ourself and our customers from experiencing any loss of value.” Well, I for one have lost a great amount of value. Python and Blender scripting school is closed forever. Sure, I can still make better and better sculpties but that is only part of the value of what you once had. The greater value, the one that can help me in Real Life is now lost.
I know that with Primstar-2 released as GPL people are able to share copies they have obtained and you will get no payments for that. Of course, many of those same people will continue to share copies, only now they will pirate them instead of freely share them. It is unlikely, if other projects are a guide, that they will suddenly buy their own copies and make you rich. In this way you are turning your fans (because they wouldn’t share Primstar-2 if they didn’t think it was pretty good) into criminals by suddenly making illegal what they have been doing all along.
I would like to propose a solution that may work for you and for those of us who want to learn from your work as well as those of us who cannot afford the cost. May I suggest that you continue with your non free license for the latest version of Primstar, yet re-release each version under the GPL after a period of, say, one to three months? This way people who pay will still have the added value of the newest features and fixes while those who cannot afford your work will still be able to find it without having to become pirates? You can also adopt Linden Lab’s model and offer support for those who pay and let those who do not search and ask on the forums for help from the community. That will provide an added value that many will gladly pay for.
I do not want the L$6000 I paid for your product back. Instead I want you to know that you have at least one customer who is disappointed in your decision and hopes you will go back to providing a GPL’d version of your software that she can not only use, but also learn from.
Thank you.
I have the impression that this may be a missunderstanding. The license change biggest impact is that it restricts the redistribution of the software.
You still get the sources and you can read them modify them do whatever you want to them as long as you keep them with you.
No. No misunderstanding.
“The license change biggest impact is that it restricts the redistribution of the software.”
Yes. Exactly. That is the very thing that makes it no longer useful as a learning tool. I can read and modify them as long as I stay in my cave and never talk to anyone about them. I can’t show a Blender or Python programmer a block of code and ask if it would be better “this way instead of that way.” Fair use, you say? Maybe. Probably. Almost certainly. But you still might sue me and I can’t afford to defend myself so it’s better not to take that chance. And I still can’t share my improvements even as patches since patch files usually have a few lines of the existing code in them as well as lines of derived code making them obvious violations of the license as well.
Will I continue to look at the source code? Maybe. My lawyer recommends I don’t answer that question in a public forum.
All this ceases to be an issue, though, if you incorporate my original suggestion. What are your thoughts on that? Can you release GPL versions a short period of time after the proprietary version? I honestly think that would make everyone happy. What do you think?
Please let me express one point: I think there is a big difference between talking about software with other people and blindly publishing the software on a public server. Of course will it be possible to share enhancements, ideas proposals whatever with us and with the user comunity. Remind that after you purchased, you get all subsequent updates for free. so if somebody comes up with a great idea, or even a patch for a bug or new functionality, you will get it. So sharing is still working.
About releasing “older versions” a few months later: Our aim is to create a rock solid software which needs only very few changes over time. I think Domino has proofed that he is capable to develop rock stable software. Primstar-1.0.0 was unchanged for 13 months before the final primstar-1.1.0 came out.
Once Primstar-2 is out we expect that the number of bugfixes over time will be low. SO the number of new releases will go down dramatically. But when that happens it makes no longer much sense to keep a GPL version 2 months behind, because it would be almost identical to the current version.
But please understand that we have not yet decided at all how to proceed with an educational license offering.
Thanks for the reply. I have read some other forums and articles about this situation and see that it’s a lot more involved than a simple license change to “protect value.” I also know that neither of you are likely to change your minds with all that has happened. And that’s okay. I’m sorry people don’t understand the GPL and the FSF’s philosophy enough to understand the very reasonable action of selling GPL’d code.
I appreciate that Domino wants to make money from his work and I support him in that completely. It is his product and his right to do with it as he wishes. He should get something back for his work. That’s why I paid for it before he took it private. That’s why I’m not asking for what I paid back. That’s why all I’ve expressed is thanks and now disappointment.
You say sharing will continue. Understand that under the current license “sharing” has a much more narrow meaning than it did before. “Sharing” is a big word with lots of meanings. Much like “blue.” There are lots of colors we call “blue.” We even call feeling bad “blue.” “Sharing” can mean put out for all to partake in, and it can mean, as it does in taxes, taking from one person and giving to another. We all share our income with the poor, even if we never give to charity. With Primstar-2 “sharing” now means “you can get it if you pay now and in the future you’ll get updates for as long as he wants to and can give them.” Before it meant “you can have it whenever you want and can get it and changes to it from anyone forever.” Of course, no one else ever contributed (or it would have to remain GPL’d) so perhaps it’s all a moot point. But then it had just started so we’ll never know. He can’t use GPL code from others any more and they can’t use his. That sharing will certainly never start, except what others will build on from his last GPL version.
I’m obviously a big supporter of GPL’d software. I also work for charities and believe in helping others regardless of the reward to me. I also greatly respect freedom, including the freedom to think and be different from me.
I wish you both the best of luck with Primstar-2. I hope Domino stays healthy and is able to make a living working on it and that the sales continue to come in. I hold you both in high esteem and thank you for the work you have done making sculpties and Blender both easier to understand and work with. I’m hopeful your tutorials will continue and you will continue to support the community with your products and knowledge. I’ll also shut up now and let you be about your business. We both have more important things to do than beat this dead horse.
You people rock, keep the money, keep making cool stuff for me to learn from and enjoy. 🙂